EP83 - Peter Finch talks about his Open Qualifying! (Peter Finch guest) FULL EPISODE

You know the fact is a lot of the very best players um even if they are working at golf clubs they'll be still putting they're practicing they're still putting the time in they're just not posting about it all right guys welcome back to the rickshaws golf show podcast everybody i'm your host rickshaws i'm here with producer guy. And we have a guest today.

Which i'm excited about because we're gonna i feel like we've got obviously loads of discuss i wanna know. And get right into the the brain behind peter finch today.

All right okay shortest podcast episode. For you guys um i feel like we've got a number of things to address um some a little bit of controversy last week we sparked some flames and fires on social media which we want to address as well um where should we kind of start this where should we go with this guy we've obviously got to start with the elephant in the room which is peter don't be lying dropping that again no that's the first thing i think because basically obviously last week i'm sure people listen to this episode listen to last week's as well. But there might be some people who didn't do. And again i guess most people everybody listening will know who peter finch is. But for the odd person listening pete who doesn't know which there won't be many obviously but how would you explain yourself in a sentence or two um golf pro turned youtuber now content creator and zoo animal apparently um that's that's pretty much that's pretty much where i'm at at the moment so quite a similar story to rick and we probably will come on to that later on in the podcast. But the reason we obviously into the elephant in the room was last week we um i think dissected would be the right word your open qualifying. For this year and it went the podcast went big there was lots of comments it was definitely our most commented podcast video yes maybe not. For the right reasons there's a lot of negativity a lot of support for pete which you'll be glad to know about so we wanted to go over that podcast episode here your take on things maybe we can slightly better articulate some of our points. And see where it ends up it's the first thing i would like to say to mp is jokes aside i think what we're trying to do with the podcast is as you'll see today.

It is very unscripted. So we turn the mics on and we will spend an hour an hour. And a half talking about all sorts of things from golf to um dominoes to sometimes we do talk about golf awesome. And we don't edit anything out it literally is what it is. And the problem with that well the benefit of that is it's authentic conversation the negative to that is that you sometimes listen back to it which i do every time. And you say things that you either didn't mean to say. Or didn't say very well so even a simple example would be i could be reading out a nightmare golf story or an email i've had sent in let's say and it might say i hit my 79 and this happened and sometimes i listen back and i'll have said. For ryan i'll said the wrong word. So you think i don't know why i said that. But also you say things that might not be the best um choice of word or phrases so anyway last week we got onto open qualifying and your score and i started that section with the elephant in the room which definitely on reflection wasn't my um wasn't my best piece of work if you like that's the right phrase and it did maybe start off like it was going to be very negative. So we'd like to apologize to you for that because maybe i should have said. So peter finch played in it not the elephant in the room i don't really have a reason why i said that. But i did. And i counted that back now and tens of thousands of people have seen that and commented on that which is fair enough. So again accept my apology on that if it you know it probably did do you ready i don't want to piss you off a little bit however. my other points about your golf. And stuff i do stand by i want to dig into that um well let's hear what let's say your take first. And let's go from there um yeah i think the main issue that what many people talk issue with i think whenever you describe something as an elephant in the room that's a problem you know it's never a it never starts off in a positive sense. So i think that was what a lot of people took a bit of umbridge with. But i think like most things on social media you know there's there's going to be a scale of reactions. And that kind of ranged from you know people who probably listened to it a little bit more closely took the points and people who jumped to my defense with a little bit too much enthusiasm i would i would potentially say but at the end of the day that a lot of that is what happens on social media if there's a dividing line drawn people will take sides. And a lot of people did that um which you know it it's something you can't control like it it's just going to happen no matter no matter what you put out i think the main thrust of what people were a little bit maybe a little bit put off buying certainly which i probably took almost a little bit too personally in some respects was when it was talked about how people who make youtube videos. And then.

Go into competitions probably i can't remember who said it. But think themselves better than they are. And let on that they're better than they are which almost tricks an audience into following along with a journey under like a false pretense. And i think that was probably the main point which was kind of raised by a lot of people. But also which kind of took a little bit more personally um and i think certainly with the the quest. For the opening stuff that i'm doing you know it's all very it's all very out there i always post all my competition results so people know exactly kind of how i'm getting on in competition so i think that was what people were getting really annoyed about. And again too much and way too much yeah i think you know it was really interesting seeing people's reaction i think people really do kind of maybe underestimate my comfort level talking about you. And your golf you know we've known each other for many many years and it's nothing i wouldn't kind of massively say to your face or wouldn't say you know sometimes there are different levels i fully fully expected this year you to post a number i i'm sure you probably did as well going into it because the way you were playing golf in the build up to it the way you again you had your first professional win which was the local tour event at marsden park where you were swinging it the way you were hitting it the numbers you like you were starting to really see trends i thought this is it this could be pete's going to post a number he's going to get it through. And then.

It was like on the back. And that was like oh like what a shame like frustrating i'm sure. For you for many people watching and your support that you get is just phenomenal regardless of whether you play good. Or bad as i got as well when i was kind of doing it a little bit as well which always surprises me i always feel like when i had a bad round i let people down. And i'm probably are you of a similar kind of have you seen that over the number of years. Or has it become less phased now i think it's i i certainly don't feel like i'm letting people down i think most people really appreciate when they watch this stuff that it is a journey about trying to get better of golf the only problem with the quest. For the open is in the title. And in the series it has a very specific point in time where you have to shoot a good score to progress through open quality it's one round of golf the build up to regional qualifying exactly so there's this huge build up and then.

There's this one point in time where if you don't play well then.

You don't get through and it was just as simple as that really i just didn't play just in play very well on the day. And it is unfortunate. But it's a case of it's a difficult thing to explain in many respects but you know i'd like the quest for the open stuff to be judged on the whole you know as a whole year season by season if you want to look at it like that and that's probably more of a fair reflection about how you play because you know everyone knows you golf's a really difficult game you can be playing amazing golf. And i've not been playing amazing golf been playing okay. But if you have one bad round at the wrong time then.

Yeah it's not it's not going to be famous saying a thousand good shots build confidence. And one shatter it really doesn't it in golf as well that that is the thing though with professional support isn't it it's like at the minute that the euro's on. And gary southgate's an amazing job but if he had an amazing six-month run in all the friendlies and lost his opening match five nil the journeys are relevant to that degree the point when it counts. So i can understand like what you're saying it is a journey. And there's a lot of document that all year and there's some really good pieces of content there but from my perspective when i last week it was about the actual result on the day. And they said maybe that is because it's quest. For the open you look at that actual that tournament result don't you one thing that seemed to really get people worked up and i don't know how you interpreted this was when i talked about how social media can be false. And a lot of people thought that i was saying you doctor your scores in vlogs to appear that you've played better than you have i don't know how you interpreted that. But that wasn't what i was saying what i was saying is that like anything like a facebook profile picture nobody puts on an ugly picture themselves do they if you go on somebody's profile picture versus the tagged photos we're all about in our profile picture that's a fact yeah. And you know with social media and i again held my hands up i do this i actively still do do this if i put a swing video on fate on youtube on instagram not on youtube i don't have youtube on instagram i make sure i put my best prettiest swing on equally i suppose like at the weekend when you had your lesson you did your best driver's shoulder the best distance. And everything else so again i had a list at the weekend with barry taylor didn't it great hit one shot that went 287 carry 300 total put on it put on instagram because that's what people do a lot of people do um. And i think the way people interpret it was i had said you go out. And play in in on videos and your scores aren't real it's not that at all but what i do think. And this is why i still believe that people often think that creators are better than they are is because yes you might post result once every couple of weeks on your instagram of how you've done the pro am. Or whatever it might be but within that there's probably most days a swing video a long drive a chip in whatever it might be that's pretty now you you must admit you wouldn't necessarily put on a horrendous shank chip very often you're going to put on your better ones more often than not because that's just what it's human nature. And now therefore. thing that people perceive online creators as being better than they actually are i mean as far as i'm concerned it it's difficult. For me to put an ugly swing on it because i've got an amazing swing it doesn't work and comps i mean i could go out to a range. And i could i could try and get a bad swing i'm not i'm not saying i'll be able to do that though um i mean i think whenever you put anything on social media certainly now um you know i've got people who kind of help me out in that regard a lot of the stuff that we put out on on instagram not. So much on twitter because i'm still looking after that which you know i need to pass off as well get someone who knows what they're doing on it um but everything there is going to be content. So you know i've put bad swings and bad shots on there for a specific purpose you know to let people know that people do hear bad shots. And to tag the mates if they've hit bad shots and to get that conversation going yeah i i'm in a position where again. And i'll i'll stand by this the reason that one of the reasons i'm playing in comps is that there is a definitive measure of how good that golf actually is. So i can put out you know great looking golf swings on instagram twitter whatever it may be. And i'll always kind of do that in the build up to a comp. And then.

We'll see what happens in that comp it's it's as simple as that and i i don't really i don't really think there's anything kind of wrong with that in many respects you know i i won't shy away from putting good shots. Or or bad shots on social i completely agree but you must then.

Understand that people do then.

Look at your good shots that you put on. And think like you said he looks like he's playing well because of the shots. And things that you see online yeah i always get this idea that. And and i kind of feel very realistic with my golf because i know where i sit with it that i'm not that great i'm okay. But i can kind of i'm not brilliant because i don't vouch to be i don't practice loads i don't put loads of time. And effort in i failed in competitions when i was playing competition certainly towards the back end of it um it was interesting though i look back at like when i kind of first started even with you 2015 2016. And i actually could play in competitions it kind of became a big thing for me is as my audience grew. And i felt like i had more people who were responsible. Or not responsible maybe accountable or or behind my journey i found it too much pressure and kind of failed from that i've always tipped my hat to you for that for that i idea because to be able to put yourself out there and still post comp scores now you've got a mass probably you're going close to a million overall followers are you on all platforms um yeah i think it's a big audience to be able to kind of at the end of the day go this is what i've done this is what i've shot i think it takes real courage. So i never would ever ever slugging him off for that i think. For me it's this idea that other people weirdly feel like i'm bet feel like i'm better than what i am like i know people will come. And see me at let's say the marriott or whatever and they'll go rick well done you like plus one handicap which i got recently i'm thinking right it's good not really it feels like it is. But on paper it is. But it doesn't always feel like that's actually how i'm playing golf like for you and this is really interesting question like how good do you think you are. And how close do you think you are to getting to like the next.

Level. And what is that level i mean you post a video this weekend which which obviously watched saying that this is the final open qualifying it's a very nice title. And thumbnail by the way um and you've and you've mentioned on there that you don't feel like you're quite there yet like could you kind of dive into that a little bit more as well yeah i mean i think quite a few points i think if we go from the first thing is you can't control how other people are going to perceive you there's no point in trying to do that. So there's going to be people on social media who look at my swing look at your swing look at our games. And say oh great goal for our terrible golfer and waitress well this get this gets on to kind of like my next.

Point i mean when you do look back at your comps when you were playing in them yeah you you're a good player yeah i i i think there's a there's a definite difference in maybe how we perceive your golf performance. And how i would perceive my golf performance yeah i would look at your golf performance. And say you strike it well you need to work on your wedges really it's been a consistent theme for about seven years now just write this down but i look at your game and i think there's a good golfer there with lots of potential if you can get over your nerves. And not worry about what people would think if you posted that score you look at your golf game. And i would from the outside what you've just said there would go into a competition with more nerves about failing way more now if you do that that's letting again other people's perception of your game actually stop you from competing. And it's turned you now into someone who doesn't enjoy that environment yeah. And the fact is like playing in complaining comps especially when you are when you have an audience when you're posting results it's difficult yeah it's hard because it's not nice to turn around. And say oh you know i shot bad score i didn't do what i wanted to do you know yeah. But every everybody reading that if every single person from 10 000 people who would watch watch that comment whatever it's going to be 10 000 people about 100 of those if they're lucky would have played well enough to win that week yeah even on the net score really it's not it wouldn't have been on a girl score not many would be probably would be your worst score let's say exactly. So where do you feel like golfing they lose all the time way more than they win obviously there's nothing to be embarrassed about yeah. So if i post a bad score as long as i can learn from that give something back to an audience that's that's all that matters it doesn't matter if you shoot a bad score no one is affected by it yeah like no one's going to see you post a bad score. And be like oh god that's that's ruined my weight i'm unsubscribing yeah you don't get that oh damn no i i've always had this idea. And we joked about it back even back in the day like you either want to shoot 65 or 95 because there's a story there like it's either i've shut the lights off played amazing or you know what i've actually had the worst round of my life because at least there's a story like mid-seventies doesn't do a great deal to a storyline let's say right to the course. Or set to yourself one of the two yeah nice coming back to you where do you feel like your game is now. And and realistically now this is what did you do 15 because you're injured did you yeah it's like the back end of 15 you had did you rest i think it was first year first year didn't i think. And then.

I think it's been this was the fifth year 2016 yeah yeah 17 18 19 no 20 21 okay. So currently right now obviously you've put more time in do you feel like you had the the best year this year is in preparation getting yourself ready like where do you feel like your game is i'm i'm really interested to know this um i don't think this year was the best preparation in many respects one of things which i probably should have shared a little bit more i think people could see because i was kind of wearing a wrist strap quite a lot like just like wrists back body slowly disintegrating um did you feel that was any fault of anything that you did either as well no not really i think it's just the case that certainly when i was younger a lot of the practice i was doing you know off mats yeah concrete hats on concrete floors concrete floors i'm not that northern. But also the fact that you know over the last you know 10 15 years i've just not looked after my body really at all um so i and that is a limiting factor as far as how much can play in practice. And then.

Obviously with trying to do all the content it's not an ideal situation yeah. So that is part of the the process which i haven't figured out. Yet well come on i'm gonna hold you this idea of where your golf is. But you just picked up on a point there which again i think was really kind of jumped on last year. Or last week shall say feels like a year ago already this idea that i mentioned can youtubers play great golf when they're documenting it describe to the audience the challenges that you might face as somebody who's in the content creation world. But also trying to play at a professional level like do you see that being quite a challenge on a daily basis yeah it's a massive channel it's a massive challenge in respects that where my golf is currently at as well is not where it needs to be to get through where i would ideally want to be as far as the quest is concerned final qualifying. So regional qualifying like my game at the moment i'm more than good enough to get through that i'm not i'm not worried about that i just had a bad day got away from me and i just finished terribly so i'm not worried about that but even if a few things would have gone my way at west lancaster got through to final qualifying realistically at the moment would i have got through that no what got through at west langs in the end. For two rounds um i think it was six. Or five quick look it was outrageous that's what i know uh senator links was something like 12 i think it was in the end yeah yeah some guy shot nine under in the first round. So yeah. So to get through to final qualifying you gotta be shooting six under par for two rounds of golf okay. So i don't know i was on there tell us about the challenges i mean the easiest way to describe it is. And it's not it's not a popular thing to kind of say but one of the reasons is because what we do as far as you know we're involved in golfing every day podcast videos you know on the course whatever it's going to be it's amazing. But it's a lot of work it takes a lot of time so if you do that which is a full-time job. And then.

You're trying to basically compete against people who are treating their golf as a full-time job yeah i've got two full-time jobs yeah. And the only problem is with the professional playing side you don't get paid. For that unless you win unless you win and the comps that i would win have one you know i ain't gonna be buying my yacht anytime soon so it's a case of because that just balanced it too don't mind asking how much did you win. For you for your win this this year do you got oh god i don't even know um i think it's about 400 honestly. But i've to be fair the the actual money behind the comps that i play and i win it sounds very kind of snooty but that's not really the point for me yeah because i know that it's the the content that i'm making around it which is probably more important yeah. And if i was really really worried about how much money i was making from it then.

That would add more pressure that i don't really want do you think again that that's where anakin went to social media. But like you said then.

That it's obviously you don't get as much chance to play because you're creating content. But like rick often gets it appears to people online that you're always playing golf and always practicing and always hitting balls in your studio which might not be the case but because you see it on social media most days it appears to people like you are practicing loads. And you know playing devil's advocate a bit some of those guys that got through regional qualifying are full-time lads who work in a pro shop who don't get to play play as much as you do. So there's also that i mean it's different final because those guys at final are full-time amateurs elite amateurs. Or full-time golf pros but at regional a lot of the guys that got through are actually guys who have full-time jobs as well i mean the same context you can flip it around. And say well because they don't post much on social media how much do you know they are practicing well yeah. But they've got nine to five jobs so i mean i've got a nine-to-nine job. And i'm still trying to find time to do it you shouldn't. But your job is golf isn't it your job's not signing a pro shop you're still eating balls when you when you're working. And you're out doing a video you're still hitting golf balls and you're still practicing yeah of course. But i think if you're going to judge if you're going to judge people by what they post on social media that's how we're going to judge you though isn't it because you are an online content creator exactly. But you should also judge other players by what they're kind of not posting as well you know the fact is a lot of the very best players um even if they are working at golf clubs they'll be still putting their practice in they're still putting the time in they're just not posting about it like posting about practice posting about what i'm doing is natural to me someone who plays very good golf they might not need to might not want to there's no no skin off their nose. And also there's a difference in the type of player that certainly i found out that i am compared to a lot of other people i cannot go into a competition having three months off it just doesn't work for me i need constant competition to actually keep that not exactly competitive edge that's not the right way of looking at it it's more the like a confidence interest it's the control of nerves basically if i'm constantly playing in competitions it's fine to get used to it if i have an extended period of time out as soon as i get back into a competition then.

That's when i get really nervous and i know that that first compact's always a bit of a bit of a write-off for me because it's just getting getting back into it where a lot of players who have had very good amateur careers who've been good as a young pro they can maybe raise the level of their game a little bit quicker than i can um. But i'm going from a position where i was a okay golfer to a very mediocre pro to now a pro who's alright to someone who wants to get good you know it's just i'm i'm gonna have to practice more makes sense. But you must also understand where i'm coming from that your whole journey is documented online on youtube on instagram etc. So when i then.

Said that's how i perceive as a viewer. Or you know watching you online that is only the way we we can is perceive what you're doing is by what you post on online. So it does appear that you do play a lot of golf because that's what we see online most days yeah of course. But again maybe that could be something that could be in the quest more you know we could we could maybe not that i'm telling you what content to make for anyone says i am but maybe you could somehow show more behind the scenes of the actual grind of producing the videos and managing staff so people actually can realize that you aren't just playing golf every day you have other aspects to your business that stop you from doing that maybe yeah i mean there's a there's two sides to that i don't think in many respects i might be wrong about this. But a lot of people are just going to watch. For the golf um you know that's cause flogs or it's equipment reviews whatever it might be and they're not really that bothered about kind of what we're doing behind the scenes that that's how i kind of see it i just i think i think they are i think that video you did with the open was unbelievable. And that showed much more of you with your dog go out for a walk at the gym it showed peter finch i don't say the real because you always are real. But like more behind scenes i think people would actually enjoy to see more of you yeah i think it's maybe that's more of a decision i've probably made over the last couple of years to because i certainly used to document it a little bit more like that yeah it's it's a case of saying well you know i could document a whole day. Or i could just focus on what i'm trying to do. And then.

Film the select amount of time and hopefully produce a better amount of content out of that so it's being a little bit more focused on on what we're showing or while we're filming so yeah that's an issue. But again like it a lot of it has to come down to the person who's watching as well to kind of understand what's going on i mean i've had quite a few messages i'm still posting videos that were filmed in scotland. And there's people messaging me saying oh i see you still in scotland can you come. For a game which it it makes sense if you watch that video and then.

Haven't seen the videos prior to that then.

Yeah that's fine you'd look at it go oh is it scotland i want to give a message that was three weeks ago yeah again that's what it comes down to how people digest social media. And like you said before about you do post all your consults. And you do i'll take my hat off to you. But john who picks up his phone might not see that yesterday and just sees you smacking a drive oh god pete's ripping it up it's like people don't see the whole picture and i don't know maybe those videos were it actually shows what it's like to have a team. And you know be really busy not just playing golf i think that would open people's eyes more you know. And again i think it's the misconception of of the audience can sometimes be a little bit false in in the fact that not their fault just how they digest information like saying that you do grind every day 12 hours a day. And kind of forget the other factors that go into it i mean i must admit back in kind of was it a couple of years ago i felt like you were doing almost weekly updates. Or was it bi-weekly updates of everything that you've done. And i felt like that gave a really really good representation of everything that kind of got involved where now for the quest for the open series is that when do you when do you release kind of content around that is it a little bit more sporadic this year it's definitely been a little bit more sporadic in the sense that i want to try. And make the videos a little bit more consistent but also have a certain topic so what we're going to try. And do this year is whenever i've got a comp. So like next.

Week i've got a few comments so it's picking a subject whether that's going to be driving chipping iron play. Or equipment or you know whatever it's going to be picking that subject focusing around that subject. And how that translates into competition performance so next.

Week it might be i think maybe around a piece of equipment that i want to put in the bag how to practice with that. And how that then.

Performs in a competition and use that as a vehicle to explain about what went in the comp and what went on that week to prepare because i think if you just do a video which is this is my update from the week it's fine there's no driving force behind it. And i think a lot of videos certainly if you want to appeal to a wider audience they need a certain subject. For people to watch yeah. So i think with updates updates are fine. But like it's very easy to scroll past an update as well if someone misses it do you sometimes feel this is a world that we completely live in. And i feel like i kind of might really answer this but i want to put it forward anyway like obviously with youtube and we're under no illusion we are as bad as anybody if you want to use that term you have to think of titles of thumbnails. And you want to keep the audience engaged obviously because we all want the views that's true that's not a negative that's that's the fact of youtube but before you said about the quest the open video some of the more behind the scenes thing do you almost get off by that because it would appeal to a lesser audience. And you kind of feel that like somebody seeing you do an actual day-to-day thing could have real value. But it might only appeal to a smaller section and that kind of you think well i'm uploading today.

I don't want to upload a video it's only an appeal to small amount of people um potentially i think certainly you know this is very kind of youtube. But you know when you have a look at what uploads actually work on youtube that's different to what would work on say an instagram story yeah. Or tweet the rest of it so it's a case of saying okay. So i want to i want to try and update and document my progress i've been doing that a lot more from a behind-the-scenes perspective on instagram yeah. And that seems to be okay whereas on youtube if you put one of those videos out a week it probably wouldn't do that well yeah. And what that does is that kind of puts a bit of a block in the way of other content that you could be putting out which would do better. And you know the reality is now i've got i've got three guys kind of working. For me doing a great job we need to make sure that they have the material to actually work with and if it's a video which we know is going to do amazing versus video which is oh here's me grinding. For a few hours at the range every day that's going to get put on the side i respect that that's completely fair it's like similar analogy. And this is what sometimes obviously i love youtube we all do it's giving us all a job. And stuff i can't you know i can't speak bad of it but what sometimes upsets me a little bit i'm sure you feel the same is you can make a really good piece of content because it's not got a good title. Or thumbnail it doesn't do that well. So like some of the break 75 videos that we've posted have been actually better than others but because there wasn't a massive kind of selling point to that particular episode it's not popped whereas when like something bad goes wrong or there's something like jcb with a like a really significant part three that's 255 yards that gets more clicks and that is just the nature of the beast isn't it sometimes you make a really lovely piece of content. And because it's not got a really strong title it doesn't get the views and it is harsh isn't it really well that side of it is is the biggest challenge of content creation like it's got to be fresh it's got to be different it's got to be attracting people's attention because like you're saying now as well you've got responsibilities you've got three members of staff you've got you've got to be making good uploads you want to grow like you want to get to the half million mark you want to get to a million mark. And that and it's those like goals that you keep driving forward that probably will dictate content sometimes um i say if it feels in i've got kind of no way i think i've got one more question on this i think we'll just move on to all the more light-hearted stuff well two more questions actually um really honestly i want your honest opinion now from one we spoke on the podcast last week did you truthfully feel like we were saying you should quit it certainly gave the impression on the pod that it was if you kind of wanted all the other kind of youtubers content creators who were playing that you're at a level know your level people are better on you. So why are you even trying that's how it really came across. And people who certainly play in competitions you can understand why they take it personally we can also understand why people who want to watch videos of competitions. Or want to watch people improving would also take that personally because what you're saying is why bother what's the point do something else whereas you've got to i certainly feel you've got to put yourself in those situations. And in those competitions to learn about yourself to learn about your game and to ultimately improve yeah there are players who are definitely better than me in the local region national level you know. And certainly going into open qualifying that the chances of me improving to that level are literally going to be zero unless i'm competing with them. And trying to learn how to get better no just just quickly on that limit one set if that's how it came across that it's not what we intended. And i even said that i think you'd do every year because why would you not i think what i was meaning. And i'll hopefully try and do in a more articulate way i may well stumble up again wasn't. So much that you should stop and that you're not good enough you should quit it was just more a case i mean if you had. And there's a lot of comments people say no you shouldn't be able to give up on the dream. And that's not it it's just more about having things are realistic achievable like a smart goal. So for example if you had a guy come in for a lesson tomorrow i know you don't coach so much but let's just say and he's a nice side 15 handicapper and he said i want to be off scratch in six months you wouldn't say that's not going to happen. But you'd probably be risk and say it might not happen there's obviously been a case where it has i'm sure and people might comment below with examples where it has might be that realistic so for me it wasn't so much that i don't think you should do it it was possibly more that maybe if it was more like the goal was actually to get through regional. For one year that is more i think you could do that i think it's realistic i think that like even now. And i'm it's great you've got support people saying come on pete one more go get to andrews next.

Year go for it of course not you need my blessing obviously but it still doesn't feel in my opinion realistic i think the realistic goal is more like get through regionals next.

Year. And get to final and see what happens personally because but again i'm plugging it in i didn't think you should quit 100 i think you should continue to do it obviously. And all the other content creationists doing i know uh james wiltshire had a little bit of a dig he wasn't happy with what we're saying it wasn't the fact we shouldn't be doing it i think making content around the subject um like i say there has been crazy examples where pros have got into the open that have gone from regional to final qualifying. And for me it was more just getting this idea like at the moment i think you're one of the best golfers that i know how close are you. Or how close do you feel like you need to get to. Or what what's the realistic pathway to get to like shooting five six seven under all the time which is probably the numbers realistically you need to be shooting to try. And get through to obviously regional qualifying not so much but final qualifying like do you have a pathway. Or a journey to try and get to those kind of goals numbers um i mean the one thing that i've always thought in it i'd love to know your take on this as well obviously you support the local pj competitions at the moment are they a good enough benchmark. Or should you be playing in bigger competitions like is is there i don't know is there bigger competitions where that the competition is more fierce where there's 120 really good golfers week in week out does that does does anything like that even exist um i think from a competition standpoint. So the local pga events now there's actually some really good players in there there's extor pros there's people with really good careers in there do you think the courses are hard enough at those events um some of them are i mean it's very different though because like some of the courses that let's say you know the the mini tours play on a lot of those probably better suits my game because they're longer a bit wider what do you mean by the mini tours uh. So yeah uh like you jimmy gator okay i was going to say euro pro. But that's obviously a little bit right is there clutch tour is that one of them yeah i know that's down south though clutch tour clutch 2020 yeah. And there's a few more to be fair yeah 1836 does that still exist yes it does yeah um. But i've not i've not looked into those enough and for me the local pj events as well they're actually well spaced out enough yeah you know because at the end of the day if i want to play in a let's say a three-day event let's say you're a pro tour. For example that's a three-day event in reality you're going to be traveling one day at least one day. For a practice round yeah that's going to be four days. And if you make the call it's three rounded yeah if you make the cuts like four to five days basically. So it's a full week gone so and i wouldn't be able to film that while i'm playing so for me it's it's a non-starter straight away and to be fair the local pj events have a better probably a better setting for me to try and get through open qualifying because you go to an event it's a one day it's a regional qualifying okay i've just got to figure out how to shoot a good score on that day there is some good names you said ryan o'neil i saw dave shack lady there's a lot of guys in there who are serious players that you can compete against to be fair yeah phil archer yeah european tour pros. And you know if if i can consistently get up around the top of the leaderboard in those events then.

I think that's a good benchmark to set myself um. And the fact is that if you go to the mini tours there's a lot of amazing players on there who are trying to make it to the tour i'm not trying to make it to the tour if i play in a four-round event that is an exceptional novelty. For me and i don't need to be good at four rounds yeah i need to be good at one round when i need to be. And then.

If i get through to final qualifier good over two rounds you've explained that really well that makes a lot of sense it really does the fact that it's a shoot out base that you're going. For like these mini these one day events are pga they're a shootout you're trying to shoot four five six hundred to try. And win it obviously do you think then..

And again this kind of goes two ways if you played in those four day events do you think that would get you into a mindset of preparation that would would make you then..

So good at one day events like do you think there'd be any benefits playing in these four day events like knowing that okay i can go out. And shoot 66 i can go out potentially the next.

Day. And shoot with 71. i've not been swinging it that well or whatever it may be i've had a bad third day and i need to go on the final fourth day and shoot at 66 or whatever to win it do you think having those four opportunities to play competition rounds in consecutive would help you in the one day events um potentially i mean it's one of those things where i just don't know i i would say wouldn't because i think what you're doing regional qualifying is a one day event you want to get hard playing golf over 18 holes. So the 18-hole ones probably are the best thing to be doing do you think that courses are then.

Tough enough again i've mentioned that like obviously west langs is ridiculously hard i i know it's it's outrageously hard golf course the rough is brutal it's long it's tight like never mind the weather conditions. And things like that but yet when i do see the local events now i've not played every single the ones locally you've played in like they aren't that test are they really would you say um am i wrong i'd love it there's a few let's say we're actually won the event kind of this year at marsden park yeah it's a basically what it's a course up in burnley near where the studio quest gulf canyon used to be. And on the face of it you look at the card and you think oh that's like six thousand four hundred yards you know it's fine. But when you actually play it it's hard is it finally tight. And fitted it's tight it's fiddly it's undulating there's loads of out of bounds everywhere because you know when you when you play short course and you see this all the time like there's a lot of pro events that go to a short course you think are they're going to tear it up yeah. And a lot of the time the scores there are actually higher than if they're playing a 7 000 yard course because they're shorter they're tighter the greens are small. And undulating it's a different challenge and i think with any comp like literally any comp you've the roof's coming out that's gonna sound like i think with um with any comp you've literally just got to play that course that you find on the day yeah. And you know if i'm going into a course which i think is easy. But then.

I'm not able to produce that score that's probably more worrying than not producing an article you know what i think i'm going to say something now i think my mind's been changed i'm i'm i'm happy to say that i'm happy to say how much i would just let me think i want to say it i'm i want yeah my mind's been changing one thing basically. So going into this i'll be honest. And kind of what i said last week was that you know you've got a personal trainer you've got all access to all the best gear you've got your studio your well your studio with your gc quad etc that you've got a massive advantage over most the guys that are entering regional. And in some ways i still think that. But i think my mind's getting changed more which i should have already known in fact. But you know my mind's getting changed the fact that actually you don't play as much golf as i thought you know you have got a team of staff you are making content. For youtube like what we do. And actually a lot of your time is spent watching other edits. Or just looking after the staff or whatever it might be thinking of ideas creating thumbnails titles doing other ventures that actually you probably in some ways are at a disadvantage to some of the competitors. And like you said the guy that works in the pro shop yeah might be working nine to five. But just jumps outside and it's some balls and you know might not have threefold staff to be kind of thinking about and monitoring and stuff so i definitely think that's from this conversation my mind has changed to that that actually you probably don't play as much as i thought you did. And that you're not in some ways you have an advantage but actually you you've got a disadvantage in some ways as well it's just a it's a situation that i find myself in which is an amazing situation. And i just need to manage it better it's as simple as that you know i've got a limited amount of time in the day but i could be getting up a lot earlier you know i could be training before the day even begins i have a normal kind of work day doing what we do. And then.

I could practice afterwards it's just about getting my kind of diary and getting my timings in order and managing that better it's the the business that we're in though and the situation already it is quite fluid you know things come up all the time you've got to do this you've got to do that. And it's managing that which is the difficult thing. For me it goes back to my point that i did raising the podcast can podca can a youtuber be good enough to to kind of do it. And it's probably because i see what a youtuber has to do a one-man band i think could a guy that is literally either a single guy. Or whatever it might be who is really good at golf who wants to document it that will happily spend until two in the morning editing that's got no commitments possibly could. But it's it's time like a lot of time goes into the film into the editing like i said it's a one-man band yeah like i i meant. And you did i know when we were at trafford we used to stay up. So late at night editing on our own trying to get the videos out for the next.

Day it's like i was knackered the day after like almost you were your body was drained i just think it's a it's a big challenge when like say you're trying to make youtube content. So that dictates what content you release already you then.

Gonna balance that content with trying to make and i'm not saying you i'm saying youtube golfers as a whole why it's why it's more challenging i do really believe this i'm almost trying to be more in defense. For youtube golf because i know how hard it is. And then.

The pressures of the audience like that does have an effect on people's ability to play golf in my personal opinion from what i found whether it's i don't i don't know if you find it like midway through around if i was on a good round of a bad round i was ready to i was already drafting what my instagram post was going to be that afternoon do you do that um i'm i'm getting better at not doing that. But definitely but wasn't it i know exactly what you mean. But i think with with what you were saying there about you know a little being a bit nervous about your audience at the end of the day i know my audience from the messages that i have. And the people who contact me you know there's people who are watching the quest. For the open videos who are you know they're a school teacher. But they're studying to be a cook whatever it's going to be you know there's people who have full-time jobs have full-time families who want to change what also they're doing to try. And live the life that they want to live and watching stupid golf videos about practice and competition seems to give people a little bit of inspiration in what they're doing and you know what i quite like how you said that that kind of it makes sense actually yeah. And again it doesn't matter golf this is golf it really really really really doesn't matter it's a life at the end of the day it doesn't matter. And at the end of the day all i want to be able to do is turn around to myself in in 20 30 years if i make it that far. And just be like you know what you gave that a good go and you did well then.

How many years come how many years though can you say now how many times do you think is this is this forever have you got a time frame have you got have you got an end goal does the goal change i'm not saying i'm just intrigued to know you might want to keep this under your hat. But does have you got a plan. Or is it just each year i'm going to take it as it comes along um yeah i think it's it's reassessing each year i think next.

Year with it being 150 150th open at st andrews it's just that's a beautiful sentence just to even think about. So it's definitely going to be kind of carrying on to the next.

Year. But i think moving forward even if it's not a quest. For the open it might be something it will be something else to do with playing because i'm quite old-fashioned really in my mentality as far as if you're a pro golfer you should keep your game in shape try. And improve playing competitions and that is i i think that's a like across the board. For me yeah even though it is it's hard if you are spending 50 hours a week depends on i mean a pro golf. Or a golf pro doesn't it because if i see someone's a professional golfer i think they make their money from playing golf professionally whereas a golf pro if you have a pro shop. Or have a custom fitting business or you're a golf psychologist who's done his pga do they have to be as good do they have to still play i think they should really i think they should not not just not because you know they want to achieve a playing goal. But certainly when i was coaching full-time. And i was then.

Playing in events around that it gave me a much better appreciation of what golfers actually go through you know playing golf is hard. And if people come in for a lesson and you're coaching them and certainly this happened at trafford a lot i was coaching people they were getting technically better. But then.

They were coming back in. And saying ah i didn't actually play well in the comp and i was personally thinking well why why haven't you played well in the comp you're swinging it better you must not be trying harder there's more than me in the bay isn't it. And then.

When you're actually playing competitions and you test yourself you learn again like how hard it is you get an appreciation. For people trying and working i think that's important. But it's obviously difficult it's obviously difficult to do you know it's difficult to be a pro working full-time doing youtube. For example working doing youtube and then.

If you're a full-time range pro if you're a coach if you're working full-time in a shop if you're custom fitting to then.

Say ah right well i'm gonna carve out time to play in a comp that's not easy to do i think it's a financial thing as well because a day out of a busy teaching diary which is guaranteed like when we were at trafford six days a week coaching i was i was doing like six nearly 70 hours of coaching a week. For me to take a day out of my diary to go and play in the competition just made zero sense from it because obviously you you end up losing money for that don't you really because unless you win it even if you win it there's no guarantee you're gonna make as much money as you would have done like there almost needs to be like in a weird way the only way you could almost do it is if if every pro you won't be able to do this in a million years. But if they were almost um a bit like when we when you're assistant you have to do seven plane events throughout the year if that was still a setting that you had to do to keep your pga qualification. For the rest of your life um but again i just i don't know how you do it depending on what what you're doing i mean i know i get that as well like you said as a coach it might have some some merit. But like it's a custom fitter or something where it's about like stats and facts and right what's in front of you does it matter if you shot 75 last week. Or 85. and and what's mad is even some of the best cul golf coaches in the world aren't great players oh no the analogy nobody could coach dustin johnson if that was the case like i'm sure you know that there are many many golf coaches a lot of the golf coaches that coach on tour have been players. And they've played out on tour at some point in the life or whatever but you don't have to be a great player to be a great coach so it's yeah i think the swings are roundabouts i'm i'm not in the mindset that you need to play in competitions to to continue to be a golf pro um. But i know a lot of people kind of have that that idea as well do we do we feel like we've rounded all up no no no no not particularly i think um i think that's kind of summed some everything up. So to summarize it i don't think you should quit i think you've got to try. And continue to shoot friggin six under i'd love to see you try and compete in some bigger tournaments but i know that's coming up because you've got the have you got the english pga coming up soon yeah that's in um that's in a couple of weeks i'd love to see how you're gonna get on with that definitely without question we did not accuse you of editing your content on youtube it was more taking the snips. And making it look like you were a good golfer on social media which everybody does instagram twitter facebook that's kind of what snippets almost a little snippet of how you're playing i think you trend in the right direction i'm intrigued to see how your content i think i think with the question open it. And again you have to take our advice or i think they they could be a little bit more that's the right word it was like a holistic view of your life i'd say yeah just just a bit more like i know you mentioned this idea of of trying to teach the audience what you've learned from your rounds could you do that more because i know you mentioned the video you just said that as you released this weekend talked about to the audience i don't think i did enough a good enough job at telling people what i learned in my round of golf. And it's even like final qualifying like i'd love to you've just been candid straight to the camera this is what i learned about shooting 79 at regional qualifying this year. And really kind of i think you'd get. So much love back from that i like say it's that balance between what what's the biggest views videos but i do think having that like because there's little things nobody really knew about your wrist injury until a couple of days before really a week. Or so before you change your putter before regional qualifying which no one knew about unless there's a video coming about that soon i think there's. So much more that and people are desperate to know like people would lap that stuff up um. So yeah it's much of my little two pence on that yeah no no it's right. And i think yeah we've been having kind of talks about how how we can do that better because it is the case that certainly what i want to do. And we did this at open qualifying. So there's gonna be another uh road to the open video coming out where there was basically a camera team following me around the whole the whole round just quickly. For people listening this is not a pete video this is an open video that they're documenting you. So it's separate i feel like there's still the right the idea a little bit off you're honest did you not copyright that do you want to say anything to us yeah you're going to say road to the open quest you're like hold on. But it's their openness about us you know i you know yeah i should have i should have taken them to task about using open yeah in their videos could they do that they might have been able to hold you to ransom. For that um genuinely i i i love seeing when you've shot great scores you know the fact that you had a holy one this year the fact you had your friggin first professional win it's definitely trending in the right direction um i'm not ending it now though are we keep doing it no no i'm just playing are you staying. For a bit and yeah yeah you don't have to would like to no because basically pete you might not know this. But we've had an issue with our podcast on apple where when for some reason once it goes over an hour they start to like not show up in the feed for days and ends how far in are we harry 50. 55 minutes really yeah maybe we could do like another this could be at the end of part one maybe they can go out on tuesday. And we can because we've got a couple more questions to answer like people saying that youtube fell out. And stuff so maybe oh and also we've got loads of questions for you on facebook maybe our boxing fight i think peter probably have you oh yeah well come on part two uh we're just trying to make things. So people click onto part two so i'm gonna keep going um not our first rodeo. So if you wanna hear in part two i'm gonna preempt the biggest argument you're ever gonna see or hear stay tuned for part two red monster this is white monster which is a better drink uh thanks. For listening thanks for your time pete hopefully we've cleared the air and people understand where we were kind of getting from. And i think you know what i definitely have changed my idea on a few things yeah it was nice to sit down we probably should have done this monday rang you up. And said tell us everything about it. But albeit that's what's happened guys thanks for listening episode number 80 whatever we'll see you should we do friday next.

Episode friday treat always goes down well we'll hear you on friday. For part two of the interview.